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Author Topic: Securing your Rig on a trailer discussion  (Read 2871 times)

Offline tjsahara00

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2017, 04:53:37 PM »
Well there will always be someone who doesn't like it.

As I heard after pulling up to a park after a long drive
"I don't like the way you have that strapped down"
my reply with kids around was I really don't ---- care!

If it works for you and you don't have any trouble then
go for it.....this is the way of discussing different ideals
and other's experience.
Kevin Pool
2016 JKU Sport
2000 TJ Sahara (RIP)

Online patman

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2017, 05:37:21 PM »
If I remember to the next time I'm out, I'll do a little experiment and mark the tire locations on the trailer using my old strapping method, and check when I get to my destination whether or not it's shifted any. I'll cross the rear straps on the way back and repeat the process

Offline Jeepster1407

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2017, 06:02:27 PM »
Didn't mean to stir the pot with this one. I was just curious of some real world experience and not from the web wheelers like myself...


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Offline tjsahara00

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2017, 06:06:04 PM »
Naw man you didn't stir anything
Just making a point of everyone does it
different....we have debated this before
It is a good discussion with all the new
straps now compared to the old stuff
Kevin Pool
2016 JKU Sport
2000 TJ Sahara (RIP)

Offline DOUG

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2017, 06:19:39 PM »
If I remember to the next time I'm out, I'll do a little experiment and mark the tire locations on the trailer using my old strapping method, and check when I get to my destination whether or not it's shifted any. I'll cross the rear straps on the way back and repeat the process

I used bumpers for a long time and occasionally got a looose strap and hate the way the jeep looked pulled down.  Wondered if the springs lost spring. Axles only for me now.

Naaa.  Don't.  Cross is a problem when a strap works loose somehow or breaks.  Then the other shifts and has a lot of slack.  Dons jumped off.

Straight forward and straight back from the attachment point is best.

My opinion is based on how you would tie down with only 3 straps, and this method creates a 3 way that allows no shift regardless of which strap you lose.  Everything is tied to the closest direct point.

If you were gaurenteed to never lose a strap, cross is good.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2017, 06:22:33 PM by Doug »

Offline clark123456

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2017, 06:31:54 PM »
When I did research on this topic, I found four camps and only one appealed to me:
1) The Frame X folks
2) The Frame non-X folks
3) The Axle X folks
4) The Axle non-X folks

The non-X folks would raise concerns that if one of the straps let loose, you have the other side of the X that would want to pull the vehicle across the trailer.  That seemed logical to me, so I avoid the X styles.

The Frame folks argued for the reduced body roll.  On the trip to Moab with Doug, he stated the need to pull the frame down to the bump stops.  That sure did not appeal to me, since it takes a LOT of tension to make that happen...and I saw his come loose frequently (almost every fuel stop).

I do know that some axle strap folks will use smaller straps to frame (bumpers, whatever) to reduce body roll while still using the axle straps to keep the jeep on the trailer.  I think Todd and Justin do this, but I could be mistaken.

Airing up the tires will help avoid what Don mentioned/experienced, since the low air pressure allows some give in the tires and pressurized tires will not have as much give/flex. 

I go for the axle in a non-X form with no concern about body roll.  I do not air up my tires, my straps are the basic ones you get at Lowes (although I will likely upgrade to the safety hook style at some point), and I have never had a problem.  Of course, i have not jumped a curb yet, but I have experienced plenty of rough roads and pot holes.  I have seen the MAC straps go slack on Wes' setup...he blamed cold weather (maybe rain) or something like that...I really don't know what happened, but it made me question if the material they use has some stretch in it versus what my cheapo Lowe's straps have. 

I do have 4 cargo ratchet binders and chain, but I was too inept to get them to function with axle straps (they just twisted around and around...very frustrating considering how much money I have in them).  I know Rob uses chain and ratchet binders successfully on his setup.
Clark
1998 TJ Sahara

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2017, 06:33:56 PM »
Quote from: Doug link=topic=15946.msg291792#msg291792

Straight forward and straight back from the attachment point is best.


That provides no lateral(side to side) resistance at all except for friction of the tires.
And the straps that pull the axle/tires downward. Still just friction, but increased friction

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Offline clark123456

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2017, 06:35:15 PM »
Quote from: Doug link=topic=15946.msg291792#msg291792

Straight forward and straight back from the attachment point is best.


That provides no lateral(side to side) resistance at all except for friction of the tires.
Tires provide a lot of resistance.  I bet you could go a long way with no straps if you didn't make sudden movements or hit curbs.

The only thing I don't like with front to back non-X is that I am pretty sure I am putting a lot of pressure on the control arm joints.
Clark
1998 TJ Sahara

Offline DOUG

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2017, 07:55:11 PM »
There is a large amount of force both down and against lateral movement from TENSION.  Example is the cables with up and down force on steel poles in a stepped design hold up the roof of the GA Dome, for a little while more anyway.

Your position that there is no force against lateral movement discounts the tension and the downward pull angles that are compressing into the trailer, but even if the tow points were level to the tie down locations, your position requires stretch of the straps or frame for movement if everything is tight.  I assume we are putting a few thousand #s of force on each of those straps. it can't physically move if everything is tight and stays tight, even with only 3.   The remaining front and rear that are in align hold it in position. 

If you tie to the suspension, that force can vary, lift, and hop.  So tie to axles.
 
Tie straight back and forward.

http://www.fourwheeler.com/features/1507-proper-ways-to-strap-a-truck-trailer/
"We tie all our vehicles down by the axle tube, the lower A-arm, or a lower suspension link, but the best bet is throwing an axle strap around the axle tube. Put the straps over smooth metal. Attaching the straps to the frame or to bumper recovery points is not a good idea because the 4x4’s suspension can compress and rebound as the trailer goes down the road, in effect loosening the straps. This can shorten the life of the straps, break the straps, or cause them to come unhooked if they do not have hook enclosures."

"There is a longstanding debate about whether you should cross your tie-down straps or run them straight. We always used to run the front’s straight and the rears crossed, but Mac’s standpoint is to run them all straight. If you run them crossed and one strap fails or comes loose, the vehicle will have a tendency to move sideways. If the straps are all straight and you lose a strap, the other three will still work to hold the vehicle in place."

Offline DOUG

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2017, 07:56:45 PM »
I consider safety clips crucial. 

What are safety clips?

Offline clark123456

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2017, 08:04:32 PM »
Doug, at this point it's about belief, not logic with the X folks.  Just like with religion, no amount of logic can change someone's belief.  It's a valiant effort you have put forth!
Clark
1998 TJ Sahara

Offline SemperFiArms

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Re: Re: ratchet straps
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2017, 08:36:46 PM »
My experience in hauling on trailers began with heavy equipment. We used chains and ratchet binders but crossing was always done. When hauling anything with tracks we used 8 points versus 4. Two in the front and two in the rear that were crossed and then another went from the track to the trailer frame at each corner. I've seen the aftermath when a load come off a trailer. When something exceeds 100,000 pounds the damage is massive.

Since I got my trailer and have hauled the WJ, I've been going from the axle tubes to the corners of the trailer and not crossing. However when I make a long haul, 75 miles plus, I will add some more to the recovery points just to keep the body more stable as we're traveling down the highway at speed.

One thing I haven't noticed is what size straps folks are using. Is the 2" pretty much standard or anyone using the 3 or 4 inch straps?

I picked up some of the 2" 3500# straps from Tractor Supply. I will be replacing them with either flat hook or the snap hook style. I'll also be getting the axle straps as well.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2017, 08:45:36 PM by SemperFiArms »
Chris
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Do or Do Not, There Is No Try.

 



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