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Author Topic: Queue up the gun debate  (Read 2046 times)

Online clark123456

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2018, 09:27:32 AM »
Stolen from my friends Facebook page. Just thought he articulated his thoughts very well.


"Gun control-definitely an issue
Mental health-definitely an issue but why is no one stating the obvious?  This country no longer seems to have a standard of ethics or good morals.  Our children need parenting and not by just the parents.  It used to be acceptable for teachers and other adults involved in the children's lives to influence them. It really does take a village.  It's disheartening that religion is frowned upon.  Whether God is real or not, he or she could do so much for this country."


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Maybe his thoughts were articulated well, but I do not think he is very intelligent.

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Clark
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Online Blue J

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2018, 11:19:47 AM »
What should be done, Clark?  Serious question based on options available to us.


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I am fine with an Assault Weapons ban.

I think anything we can do to make it more difficult for Weapons such as AR's and other auto and semi-auto weapons stay out of the hands of kids.  Making it more difficult will have an affect.
I think our elected officials are smart enough to craft a bill that will allow us to keep our guns and make it much more difficult for kids and those that are mentally ill from acquiring them. Didn't we have a ban in the 90's? Did we have less mass murrders then? Is there data on this?

If I remember correctly the kids at Colombine didn't use AR's....I think they just had shotguns, rifles, and pistols.

I know there are laws on the books already. There needs to be some fawking accountablity.

Hunting-I didn't grow up hunting with an AR or a M-16. I had a Daisy then a Shot Gun.  When I grew up I knew that if I even touched any of the shot guns or rifles with out my Father being around. I was going to get an ass whippin'. I got enough of those as it was.

Kids today get rewarded for kills in video games. That's F'ed up.

I am not in some sort of delusion that banning one class of weapon will stop all the Mass Murders. I think it needs to be a multi pronged approach to the problem. Posting armed Vets and or LEO's at every school is a great idea but we can't even fund schools with the educational materials need now.
Can we make our schools fortresses? Sure.  Metal Detectors at every door  and one way in and one way out through guarded halls.

Will that stop every nut job, probably not. They will go to Wal mart or a movie theater.

I hear lots of talk about it being a mental health issue. Sure it is, and having an irresponsible Government That won't fund any mental health Services does not help. Is it the Gov'ts responsibility? only if they want to try to help solve the issue. Clearly they would rather push it to some else by offering prayers and condolences.

How much does the NRA contribute to Mental Health Services for those most likely to abuse guns?

There is not a clear path forward.

Open and honest discussion and pushing our elected officials towards any sort of positive change is the goal.

Jim
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Online Big Dave

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2018, 11:41:15 AM »
Clarke, a registration will not happen.

Jimbo, if you are correct, hunting rifles & handguns were used at Colombine. How would a "assault weapons" ban have stopped or altered the outcome?
The term "assault weapons" is a made up name to scare folks. They are a sporting rifle.
There are laws on the books that makes DUI illegal but there are folks arrested daily for it. Have you ever heard of ANYONE utter the words ban alcohol or cars?
Same difference. Its not the guns fault.

There have been several knife attacks across the pond where 50 to 100 people were killed. Japan is one.

So lets ban guns, knives, crock pots, pencils, or anything pointy. Literally, anything can be made into a weapon. Timothy McVeigh used cow shit & a box truck. 

Mental health is the underlying issue & until out our elected officials address this issue we will continue to have mass killings, even if no firearms are involved.

Online clark123456

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2018, 11:50:48 AM »
I wouldn't mind a way to hold people accOuntable who provide, or don't secure, guns used in these killings.  Right now the only accountability has to do with the individuals who commit the crime, regardless of how they get the weapons.

Tell me again, what is wrong with the registry?

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Clark
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Online Big Dave

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2018, 12:00:18 PM »
Gun stores are robbed. I'm positive they keep them locked up. You gonna blame them or the thugs?

A gun is just a tool. A very loud tool.

FYI, the cops went to the shooters home 39 times starting in 2010. The guy was 10 or 11 when this became a issue yet nothing was done for or with him.

Parent(s) should have seen some clue to two.

Online patman

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2018, 01:23:39 PM »
I wouldn't mind a way to hold people accOuntable who provide, or don't secure, guns used in these killings.  Right now the only accountability has to do with the individuals who commit the crime, regardless of how they get the weapons.

Tell me again, what is wrong with the registry?

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I actually think they are... if I'm not mistaken, they can be arrested for providing or not restricting access to someone who commits a crime
Patrick

Online clark123456

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2018, 01:26:07 PM »
I wouldn't mind a way to hold people accOuntable who provide, or don't secure, guns used in these killings.  Right now the only accountability has to do with the individuals who commit the crime, regardless of how they get the weapons.

Tell me again, what is wrong with the registry?

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I actually think they are... if I'm not mistaken, they can be arrested for providing or not restricting access to someone who commits a crime
They should do a perp walk for those folks..educate the public.

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Clark
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Online patman

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2018, 01:28:51 PM »
Jimbo, the 90s AWB was ineffective and there was no measurable statistic to prove it did anything.  The VT shooter also only used low capacity magazines, so large capacity magazine bans are also pointless.

The only point of these laws/bans was for certain people to say they accomplished something. Many proponents of these rules openly stated (later on) that the true intent wasn't to deter that activity, but to use as a stepping stone to a total ban on firearms. Luckily, they failed.
Patrick

Online patman

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2018, 01:31:12 PM »
I wouldn't mind a way to hold people accOuntable who provide, or don't secure, guns used in these killings.  Right now the only accountability has to do with the individuals who commit the crime, regardless of how they get the weapons.

Tell me again, what is wrong with the registry?

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I actually think they are... if I'm not mistaken, they can be arrested for providing or not restricting access to someone who commits a crime
They should do a perp walk for those folks..educate the public.

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Agreed. One thing I can compromise on is raising the age of purchase from 18-21 for rifles unless having a military waiver. Kids are dumb, younger kids are dumber
Patrick

Online BigMike

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2018, 01:49:07 PM »
Nobody wants to discuss the issue, only push their own agenda.  We keep going around and around with this issue.


Let's try to get to the core problem with mass murder.  Take away the tools ... AR's, AK's, shotguns, trucks filled with fertilizer and diesel fuel, etc. 


My take on it is the disregard for human life.  Murder is illegal but it still happens.  If every AR-type gun didn't exist in the hands of civilians, just as many children would be dead today.  Some people have evil intentions and will find a way to kill people.


Now, no matter what happens on Capitol Hill, AR's will never be banned.  The gun control issue will rage on and in the end, nothing will happen ... IMO. 


So how do we protect children at schools?  Well, how do we protect VIP's?  How do we protect money in a bank?  How do we protect the President?  With guns.  Even then it is 100% effective but it is a deterrent. 


Arm the staff at schools that are willing to be trained and carry.  Again, IMO, if the hero coach that shielded kids with his body had a weapon, he probably wouldn't be dead and would have saved more lives than he did. 


A very long-time friend of mine had his own church in Ohio before retiring to FL.  He carried a .38 in a shoulder holster under his suit while preaching on Sundays.  He was always armed.  When the kid in SC shot those people at bible study, I texted my friend a couple days later and said "I'll bet that kid wouldn't have killed anyone at your bible study", he replied "nope, no way". 


Some schools in the US have already implemented arming their staff.  The Left hates this idea because it calls for more guns, not less ... all the while they enjoy being protected by armed security. 


I'm open to your view on this.  What do you think the core issue is?

Online Blue J

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2018, 01:51:23 PM »
Clarke, a registration will not happen.

Jimbo, if you are correct, hunting rifles & handguns were used at Colombine. How would a "assault weapons" ban have stopped or altered the outcome?
The term "assault weapons" is a made up name to scare folks. They are a sporting rifle.
There are laws on the books that makes DUI illegal but there are folks arrested daily for it. Have you ever heard of ANYONE utter the words ban alcohol or cars?
Same difference. Its not the guns fault.

There have been several knife attacks across the pond where 50 to 100 people were killed. Japan is one.

So lets ban guns, knives, crock pots, pencils, or anything pointy. Literally, anything can be made into a weapon. Timothy McVeigh used cow shit & a box truck. 

Mental health is the underlying issue & until out our elected officials address this issue we will continue to have mass killings, even if no firearms are involved.

They tried an alcohol ban at the start of the last century.

Mental Health is the Core issue.

Do you think DUI has gone down or up since before MADD  started with their Ad Campaigns and laws were put on the books to enforce DUI's? Society has changed. and It needs to again.

Personally I think we need to bring back public executions. And hang anyone caught committing mass murder or any murders.
Jim
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every upgrade, 4 more are required, and they require 4, and so on.

Online Blue J

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Re: Queue up the gun debate
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2018, 01:53:01 PM »
Nobody wants to discuss the issue, only push their own agenda.  We keep going around and around with this issue.


Let's try to get to the core problem with mass murder.  Take away the tools ... AR's, AK's, shotguns, trucks filled with fertilizer and diesel fuel, etc. 


My take on it is the disregard for human life.  Murder is illegal but it still happens.  If every AR-type gun didn't exist in the hands of civilians, just as many children would be dead today.  Some people have evil intentions and will find a way to kill people.


Now, no matter what happens on Capitol Hill, AR's will never be banned.  The gun control issue will rage on and in the end, nothing will happen ... IMO. 


So how do we protect children at schools?  Well, how do we protect VIP's?  How do we protect money in a bank?  How do we protect the President?  With guns.  Even then it is 100% effective but it is a deterrent. 


Arm the staff at schools that are willing to be trained and carry.  Again, IMO, if the hero coach that shielded kids with his body had a weapon, he probably wouldn't be dead and would have saved more lives than he did. 


A very long-time friend of mine had his own church in Ohio before retiring to FL.  He carried a .38 in a shoulder holster under his suit while preaching on Sundays.  He was always armed.  When the kid in SC shot those people at bible study, I texted my friend a couple days later and said "I'll bet that kid wouldn't have killed anyone at your bible study", he replied "nope, no way". 


Some schools in the US have already implemented arming their staff.  The Left hates this idea because it calls for more guns, not less ... all the while they enjoy being protected by armed security. 


I'm open to your view on this.  What do you think the core issue is?

Mental Health is the Core issue.

Many of my liberal friends are great marksmen and women. Not all Liberals think guns are bad.

Jim
'13 True Blue JKU
every upgrade, 4 more are required, and they require 4, and so on.

 

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